STATter 911

Holly crap!
I don't even know what to say.
 

Now you see what we're dealing with up, commisioners who don't have a clue!
 

one day he or a relitave will need us then he will figure it out!
 

Two things... These commissioners are not the brightest bulbs in a box. It's scary to think that a couple of these guys are baffled by the requirement that there be two people on an BLS ambulance.

However, the chiefs are doing their department a disservice by using a metric ton of fire department lingo in their presentation. Admittedly, I fall into the same trap myself sometimes when talking to non-fire folks. We need to learn to communicate our needs to the public in plain, everyday, English.
 

We, as the fire service, don't always do the best job on educating the public/officials what we do and why we do it. This is a prime example that they have no clue what we do.
Frederick DFRS is about to be spread so thin when these new stations open in a month, it's not even funny. Stay tuned because I am sure it is going to get more interesting.
 

That guys is an idiot and it'll never change!

You can't make good a report to an accurate narrative if you're the only one.

Just move on, this guy is a wacko!
 

With logic like these guys use they should be in the U.S.senate
 

I remember going on many calls driver only... Shootings, stabbings, crashes...I even went driver only on a working code. Every single time I always heard the family members or some citizen ask where the other person was... Even the average citizen knows there's 2 seats in the front of the ambulance, and the passenger seat is not for a patient. What a moron to suggest this... Call for more volunteer support, paid on call or God forbid pay people to be on that ambulance!
 

Later in the meeting the commisioners wanted to have the county lawyers look into violating federal employment law by taking away LT. overtime. These folks do not have a clue
 

Commissioner Kai J. Hagen has an IQ of an azaela bush. Glad I don't live in that area!!
 

Where do these people come up with these ideas.Evidently they are not concerned with the well being of the public.
 

A few years ago a Memphis city council member wanted to know why "reserve equipment" could not be sent a false alarms and save the new equipment for "real fires"
Not to be out done a Shelby County commison member wanted to know why they had to pay for fire protection, "What did the home owners do before there was a fire department".
 

Why yes, the Frederick County commissioners are absolutely tragic. Not a clue how a fire department operates. They have shown this time and time again with every fire department issue that comes before them. There are plenty of examples of how things work well in other areas. But these morons feel the need to reinvent the wheel. And they aren't very good at it. Stay tuned for the next screw up.
 

What the %$*@!!!!!!!!!
 

WHAT?????????????
 

Whether you are dealing with politicians or "bean counters", you need to realize that each new crop of them need to be educated about Fire Service/EMS operations- the why (statutes, rules, standards), the how (best practices for fire & EMS), and the local idiosyncrasies (combo dept, volunteer elements, mutual aid issues, etc).

It is incumbent upon us to contact the newly elected officials, and to regularly report to the entrenched ones, in order to help them understand the services provided to the community. Point out significant incidents as examples- both locally & regionally. Explain to them about the good & bad in your department, the costs, and the implications of both improved and reduced service levels.

It is the same type of ongoing, preventative efforts we perform to ensure public safety, like checking hydrants, performing fire code inspections, and teaching fire safety to school children. The work is never ending due to human nature, fire, medical emergencies, bad luck, and the newest crop of politicians who don't understand the cost-benefit analysis involved with providing public safety services to the citizens.

ltfd Seattle FD
 

Can anyone say law suits I can. Oh how about shut downs. EMT not just a driver from new york.
 

OMG!!! Are you serious! I can't wait until the day these dumbass comissioners need the help of Frederick DFRS! I am only the wife of a firefighter and know that I would want more then just a driver to take me to the hospital - no matter what was wrong with me! Of course, now you know why I don't call 911 (I am not in the county, don't worry!) and take myself!
 

WOW, what a dumb ASS COMMISSIONER!!!
 

I have watched the way the Fred.Co. Commissioners have dealt with the fire dept issues for the last 3 years, I must say they have reached an all time level of absurdity.They are already being sued for illegal labor practices, I guess lets spend more of the taxpayers money on lawsuits.Hart himself stated during that meeting that some Lt's make more than Batt. Chiefs, sounds like county mismanagement to me.They seem not to listen to their staff, and not worry about the citizens, but only the feelings of an outdated vol. assn.I have seen a group of politicians that hate Career FF's as much as these commissioners. Darn shame they want to keep the fire service in the dark ages
 

I find it intriguing that County Comm. Lennie Thompsons' wife was appointed to a fire service staffing committee. Gee, bet everyone on that committee spoke freely. No conflict there.I enjoy how Mr. Thompson berates and belittles the Frederick Co. Fire & Rescue workers and staff. I really like how Mrs. Thompson espoused the per diem nursing plan that she "couldnt get the committee to listen to" wonder why? This is what these folks do for a living, not part-time, not as a hobby when they have the time.It's time to let the Fire and Rescue services group do their job, and its time for Ron Hart and David Gray to go back into retirement, the world has definitely passed them by!
 

Are these people serious? A county resolution to manage the day to day operations of the FD! The best laugh was the commissioner that said all you need is one at the foot and one at the head of the stretcher.......yeah great, if it's a code maybe Clem or Jeb (potential by-standers) can do compressions for them, and hell, if all else fails just strap the patient in tight hop up front and drive as fast as you can to the E.R.
 

I smell a BIG Lawsuit in the making!
 

Here we go again. Its hard to believe that a county fire and rescue service so close to the Metro area is still being operated strictly by politicians and a volunteer assn. Didnt the county government pay for a study to be done? In an evening meeting, the study was presented, only to have Ron Hart and his vol. assn buddies slam it because it takes some of their power away. I urge all to go to the Frederick Co. Comm. website and view some of these past meetings and watch & listen to some of the earlier absurdities that Hart, Gray, et al have spewed out regarding the fire service. Thompson...It is appearent this guy is willing to risk lives to save a few dollars. His "resolution" to create "acting officers" and take the responsibility away from the DFRS, as they are refered to, spells disaster, and David Gray eluding to volunteer officers supervising career staff...irresponsible to say the least. Supposedly, there is a training standard in Fred.Co, but exceptions are made and standards changed when the"good ole boys" dont meet them. The County comm.'s let the vol. assn. police it themselves. Ladies & Gents of the Frederick DFRS watch your backs,you're all you have.Your county government isnt operating on all cylinders, or maybe just not operating with all their marbles.
 

Hello. Commissoner Hagen here, making an effort to communicate, in spite of having the "IQ of an azalea bush."

Frankly, I find this extended discussion (and all the ridicule, and attacks) to be somewhat out of line, and certainly not productive - at least insofar as one simple question was misinterpreted, taken out of context, and assumed to be more and different than it was.

I certainly wasn't suggesting anything, or advocating for anything. I asked one basic question, out of curiosity, which was whether or not it was ABSOLUTELY necessary, legally and otherwise, in ANY and ALL circumstances, for there to be a second person on hand in order to consider ANY sort of transportation, for ANY reason.

That was nothing more than that: A quick and basic question, in the flow of a broader conversation. Not a comment about policy or, in any way, a recommendation. It doesn't speak well of some others (mostly anonymous, at that) to see the sort of responses posted here (and elsewhere, as well, I suppose).

In the first two years of my first term as a commissioner, I have learned a great deal about the fire and rescue services in the county. I have read a great deal, spoken with a lot of people (and met with anyone who asked), gone on ride-alongs, attended meetings and dinners (career and volunteer-hosted), etc.

Overall, I would say that I have been very supportive of the career staff, while also trying to be supportive of the many volunteers in the county, too. And, throughout, recognizing and trying to understand and address the challenges and stresses inherent in a situation where the county is growing and things have been (and still are) changing rapidly.

If you review my voting history over the last two budgets, for instance, I think you will see that I've been at least as supportive as any of the five commissioners in trying to address and meet the needs of our expanding personnel (which is just one part of the broader equation, of course.)

If one simple comment or question negates all of that, one has to wonder.

kai
 

What a pity that Frederick County Government is the laughing stock of the area! Why don't the Frederick Co. commissioners run the government, and stay out of DFRS since its obvious they know nothing about fire and rescue. Isn't it odd that you never hear about other departments, like roads, water and sewer and parks. Oh wait I did hear in the last couple of weeks where they voted to allow drinking in the parks which they didn't have a public hearing on and it is just another dumb decision they have made. They do like to stick their nose in DFRS alot, maybe that is why DFRS can't get anything done because of the commissioners noses! Somebody better wake up and stay out of fire and rescue and let the mgmt. staff do the job they were put there to do, after all with the commissioners reinstating drinking in the parks we are going to need alot more EMS people to run the calls with additional accidents, drunks falling at softball games and the innocent people that are hurt as well. But I guess with Hart's idea of one man ambulance they shouldn't need anymore help just put the drunk up front to help the driver/provider get to the hospital! Put Ron Hart back to retirement where he belongs and should have stayed, let him drink beer and remember the "good ole days, back when"... that he is still living in. WAKE UP FREDERICK CO. COMMISSIONERS, Get real, do the job you were put there to do, get out of the business you don't know anything about before the citizens of this county pay for your stupid ideas and have no one to protect us or our property!!
 

Do the facts matter at all.

With regard to the comments about alcohol in county parks (and the anticipated increased in emergencies, etc.):

The county commissioners did have a public hearing. That was in addition to a number of public meetings at which the issue was discussed, before and after the hearing.

The change does not allow the consumption of alcohol throughout the parks.

Rather, it is enabling legislation that allows the commissioners (with assistance and advice from the Division of Park and Rec., and the Park and Rec. Commission) to allow alcohol, for certain people or groups who register and pay a modest fee, in a FEW specific park facilities.

That would, for instance, allow champaigne at a wedding reception at the Browning Building, or beer or wine at a family reunion that reserves a certain large picnic shelter, etc.

This is consistent with (but at least as restrictive as) a majority of counties in the state.

Sorry to sidetrack the conversation, but, as with the assumptions and assertions about the one comment that started all this, facts should matter.
 

Commissioner Hagen - If you are such a fan of the fire service. How come you still vote against bargaining with the local union? As a democrat you should be supporting the labor movement and not the Thompson retoric. This group of commissioners has fired, retired or transferred the majority of everyone invovled in the lawsuits. Those that are in the know still don't understands how the HR Director kept his job? Since he held the puppet strings! So why are you blaming the fire figthers for the previous managements mistake(Thompsons administration)of promotions and pay disparity. Seems to me that bargaining with the union is in the county's best interest. The career firefighters are running the majority of the calls in the county anyway.
 

Commisioner Hagen stated that it was one simple question. If that is the case why did the discussion about one person ambulances conntinue for several minutes. After one of the reps from DFRS stated that state law required two providers one commisioner was heard asking if state law could be changed.
 

A lot of this boils down to the perceived need of the County Commissioners to micro manage the Fire Service. This result from having a Hostile “traffic cone” Union President, obvious self serving clicks in the DFRS management and a lot of people promoted to a position that they have no clue about. The turnstile at the office door of the DFRS director does not help. Add in a lack of accountability (recruit death with no real repercussions) and the stage is set. Screw up in your current job and we will create a new position for you.

Too many Chiefs and not enough Indians and this is on both sides of the fence. A county “EMS Battalion Chief” that responds and takes non EMS sectors on working incidents and a volunteer chief that seems to be everywhere, but is he really the chief of his department? Depends on which hat is being worn that day.

For some reason we are stuck in the 80's. Flush the toilet, career and volunteer, and get rid of what is stinking up the system.

On the other side of the fence we have volunteer "Chiefs" that do not meet the previous training standard and no one to enforce the current standard. How about the Chief that lit himself on fire burning brush, is he qualified?

Add in a dose of people that think a class gives you experience and we are doomed to fail.
 

As everyone has viewed in this disturbing video the BOCC has no clue on how the FD runs in Fred. Co. That county needs to become a Nationally recognized FD and seperate from the Vollys. There are some great combo systems throughout the nation and Balto Co. FD has a very good one. It keeps both Career and Volly seperated on the station level but they still must work together in the field. Fred. DFRS just needs to get free from the grasps of the Volly Assn. The BOCC needs to step back and let the career guys run their own show.
 

It is a shame that the BOCC is making a mocary out of the Fred Co DFRS and its employees. They are opening themselves to lawsuits left and right. 1 on and ambo and acting Lt's wouldn't fly down in the 5th ward. The local union needs to inform the john q public how the BOCC is putting everyone at risk....just food for thought
 

Glad to see that Commissioner Hagen is using his time wisely by defending himself on Statter911. I mean really, what else does he have to do?
 

As one who does research and is a taxpayer, I have viewed this and other commissioners meetings, and quite frankly am disturbed. If ones goes back to the TriData report meeting, we find that the commissioners relly didnt care what the report said. I find it interesting that after spending a good deal of tax dollars, all proposals made in the report that the volunteer fire assn. didnt like, were basically abandoned. I have to ask why my tax dollars were wasted just to have a group of volunteer who evidently do not believe that county money, employees, and equipment not be managed by the county govt. I do find it interesting that Comm. Thompson is a member of a local volunteer company as well as many of the DFRS management staff. I have to ask why conflict of interest charges or investigations have not been made. When you have Commissioners, Bureau Chiefs, Battalion Chiefs etc. as members of these volunteer groups, I have to wonder if the best interest of the citizen and taxpayer is being considered, or the personal agendas of their "home" volunteer company. Lastly, if this were private industry, Ronald Hart, David Gray, Charles Jenkins and Lennie Thompson would be out on their collective rumps for irresponsibilty and reckless management I look forward to voting against the commissioners in the next election.
 

I would like to thank Commissioner Hagen for replying. Agree or disagree he at least is willing to discuss the issue. Commissioner Hagen: one of the most positive things that the board could do to resolve the growing issues is to sit down with the union and hammer out a contract. While this may not seem like a popular option to you it will benefit both sides. By establishing pay scales and correcting the erroneous errors of the HR Director and previous administrations you will be able to save the county revenue currently being spent on time consuming litigation. I believe the lawsuits will take car of themselves if the commissioners are willing to fix the problems of the past. Management of DFRS is working very hard to make tough decisions, don't ignore their expert advise. Correct me if I'm wrong, but DFRS currently has a 2 million dollar budget surplus and as Chief Leatherman said during the public hearing they are currently only spending approx $43,000 every two weeks on overtime while $70,000 is budgeted. If they have been able to reduce and save this much why are they receiving so much attention? Overtime is inevitable when you provide a 24 hour essential service. By placing lower trained individuals in a position of "acting" you are setting your self up for major problems. Kai as a tax payer of Frederick County and a life long resident I am asking you to make things right by the firefighters that protect you. Volunteer and career issue will always exist to a certain degree, it's the nature of the beast. By the commissioners taking on a micromanagement role things will only continue to worsen.
 

We have a special unit where one person transports a person by themselves, its called a taxi cab!!!
 

The real issue here is political immaturity. The question the commissioner posed is a good one - but one that is asked in an office or firehouse with a few knowledgable people. And it should be framed in a larger discussion about the rules/laws/regulations that govern emergency services.
Political immaturity is posing the question in a public forum where every word is measured, analyzed, dissected, etc. Comm. Hagen needs to observe how Obamma picks and chooses his words - and gives great though to the questions he asks in public.
 

If you look at the context of Commissioner Hagens' question, it follows the statement made ny Ron Hart saying you only need one person on an ambulance. I think' or at least hope Comm. Hagen was trying to get educated so as to make a better determination on the subject matter. However, the commissioners entertaing Mrs. Thompsons (happens to be Comm. Thompsons' wife by the way)is truly irresponsible. Frederick Co. needs to let their DFRS manage the fire service. I am not discounting the volunteers. They still provide the best service they can, but being realistic, I'm paying a tax for 24/7 service in my area, along with county purchased apparatus, and now buildings. This should be managed by those who my taxes pay for. It is time for the county to establish a county fire dept. like the rest of the jurisdictions that tax for service, and let them run it.
 

Kai Hagen, the best thing you can do is to take the rest of them idiots a you have with you on the board and quit. Lastly do forget to take that retard Ron Hart with you when you go
 

No unit should ever go to the scene of an emergency by themselves. It is unsafe. If something happens to the responder who will help protect him or her? Who will know when something is wrong if the responder can not call a mayday? If all you have is one person that can respond, do not respond. Your system is fatally flawed and needs another solution than single person response.
 

He never would have asked Stan Poole that question. Where is Neary when you need him
 

Your right Stan Poole would have already had the answers, because he knew the commissioners questions before he walked in the room.

Watch again Neary was there! It looked like he chose to make sure the LT's were kept in the seat. Apparently the BOCC doesn't know how young of a department they have in the field. Like any other meeting I think he only had 5 minutes to rebut their hour of micromanaging.
 

Thank you to Commissioner Hagen for replying. I applaud you for trying to get educated on the fire service. You seem to be upset that you are being unfairly judged on one comment or conversation. I think what most of us are reacting to is that despite your "education", you are asking a question that any body with 5 minutes on the job would know - so it doesn't appear that your "education" did you much good. I live in Frederick, but work for a neighboring county, but I know a good many people that work for you. They are smart and capable. Go talk to them and find out what they need to do their jobs. And refusing to bargain with a union in this day and age is just plain wrong.
 

Take US 15 North to Seton Ave, turn left. There you will find a school for teching people how to manage and run a Fire Departments. Frederick County probbly has more resources as far as industry experts than any community in the USA, it baffles me that they continue to have all these problems while being the home to the NFA.
 

I have to wonder fi its political immaturity or political idiocy. Having watched a few of the commissioners' meetings, I get a sense that they hear what they want to. Ron Hart, & David Gray in particular asked the same questions in the last two meetings with the DFRS people, and got what I feel was good answers. Unfortunately, it seems that even though we (taxpayers) are footing the bill for a fire service, the Frederick Co.Volunteer Fire Assn.( I will stand corrected if thats not the official name) seem to be the political favorite. I have read the budget that the County gives those folks, and wonder why I donate, pay a tax, and then get billed. What is it that these volunteers do besides keep OUR (the taxpayers) fire service in an unoperative state. I dont blame them, I think that most that I have met or know are dedicated, however the leadership leaves much to be desired. The BoCC must take the proper steps and remember YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE for the safety of the citizens. Not some self serving good ole boy club
 

As a taxpayer in Fred. Co. I am thoroughly fed up with the way our tax dollars are being distrubuted. Some of these mega mansions that these volunteer companies build with our money is upsetting. They get a hand out from the community, money from the county for their operating budget and ems billing. Now why should the volunteer corporations receive money for EMS if the calls are ran mostly by the career staff? That EMS money should go back to the fire department and the county. Also i have seen and heard that certain volunteer companies (not gonna mention because one offender covers my house) will make the paid guys sit in the firetruck fully staffed and wait 2-3 minutes before they leave. They're doing this just so the volunteers can ride the big red truck. If my house was burning and the firetruck was sitting on the front ramp waiting for some kids to show up I would be livid. How dare the volunteers treat us like that and then turn around and ask for donations and handouts.

Just my 2 cents,
DDE
 

Well DDE,
you hit a nerve! 84 percent of all calls in frederick county are made by career ff/emt/pm--PERIOD.Yes they keep some money for doing very little. some will set in the station and watch the ambulance fail because the next call could be for the fire engine.If the county vol. fireman assoc had 3000 members as it claims , who ride this would be different. Remove the 2700 bingo workers,pancake flippers and whiners and that is close to how many vollys make calls--300. Now for your statement of waiting to go on calls unitl the folks come from home THIS IS TRUE!!! names and station numbers can be furnished. You can have 3 certified ff/officer on the unit and you must wait 3 minutes before you can go help someone who may be trapped in a fire or in a auto accident.outside thinking is needed--sent help
 

DDE, You should e-mail your post to all 5 county commisioners. I beleive that if the residents of the county were as informed as you there would be an uproar about how fire service is handled in this county.
 

As a taxpayer in Frederick Co., I excpect the career staff to respond when I pick up the phone and dial 911. They should not have to sit and wait for the volunteers who may or may not show up. In my opinion that is a delay of essential service. And yes, I have heard the excuses about the career staff having to wait on the volunteers to show up to have a full crew. Why is the career staff put in this situation to begin with? Each station should be staffed with an ambulance and engine crew. I have also gotten wind that the five stations getting ready to switch to 24 hour coverage have only requested enough staffing for the ambulance. The last time I checked, I was paying a FIRE tax for fire and EMS service. The commissioners of Frederick County need to wake up and realize who is running 85% of the calls and stop catering to the FCVFRA.