STATter 911

Sounds like "they" were worried about everything except the poor woman on the third floor.

On the upside, they did get rehab set up quickly and effectively.

Why didn't they work the woman and transport her after they did eventually find her?
 

Per Fairfax's own Townhouse Manual;
"As a general rule, certain situations should cue the officer-in-command to request a second alarm such as:
- fire in two separate occupancies
- fire on more than one level of the townhouse
- KNOWN RESCUES"

Thirty seven seconds into the tape the officer in charge (E419) is informed of a KNOWN RESCUE, yet a second alarm is not called for until six minutes and six seconds into the tape by the battalion chief. Totally unacceptable!
 

I hate to be an armchair commander but it sure sounds like they are more concerned with doing the whole operation "correctly" and by the book rather than going in and kicking butt. Maybe if the commander spent less time playing with all his toy soldiers and more time seeing that wet stuff is put on the red stuff, we would have less of these problems.
 

There is no excuse what so ever for that poor lady to have died. Every member who took part in the primary search of the third floor should be fired. There is no excuse not to be able to find a trapped person who has told you exactly where they are trapped.
I dont know how those on the call that did the primary search can call themselves firefighters. They are a discrase to the fire service.

Fairfax FD needs to "man up" and start getting aggressive, because aggressive firefighting saves lives. DC is a perfect example. They saved two kids after being aggressive and preferming a search without knowing where the kids were. Yet they were able to find the kids and save them because they have what Fairfax does not, good firefighters.
 

Speaking of 'manning up', "Anonymous"...

How about 'man up' and sign your post?
 

Fairfax County needs to become aggressive and let personnel do the job. Everyone is so worried about what a Chief officer is going to say, I say just do your job and impress that Chief of what can really happen if he/she didnt micro manage personnel. The problem is the officers are second guessing themseleves because of the poor mangt styles Fairfax has.
 

This is a real tragedy for this family. This goes to show that just because you throw alot of money at a department does not mean you get quality personell by no means. There is no excuse for not finding a victim that you know is inside in a timely fashion, This is exactly what we all train for but I guess wearing vests is more important then protecting the citizens. Which ever crews didnt find her FIRE THEM!!!
 

It is tragic that someone lost thier life as the result of a fire. By reviewing the blogs here it is evident none of the 'anonymous' authors have ever fought a structure fire. Well, I have and I can say that trying to make your way through a home filled with smoke, while attempting to navigate a floor plan that you are unfamiliar with and contend with the enormous collection of personal items one may accumulate is exceeding difficult. Until you have been there yourself, judge not as it's not your job to judge. People die in fires, it's a sad fact but blaming the fire fighters for her death is not reasonable. Fire fighters train to save lives however, thier personal safety comes first and while it's not something you will hear often, it is the absolute truth.
 

I agree with texas FF, as Im a FF myself. Its is always sad when someone dies in a structure fire wheater it be a person who lives at the structure or a FF. From the ouside looking in its easy to say well they the FF's should have done this or should have done that but no one but the FF's inside and God know whats really happening inside. My prayers and thoughts go out to the victims family and the FF's that were on scene. It really bothers me when all these people are makeing negitves comments about Fire departments when the closest they have came to a fire was rubber necking while driveing by, Im a firm believer that if you think you can do this job then come on down and apply.
 

Unfortunately the fire service today is spending too much time trying to justify their existence by extensive diversification of services provided at the cost of real fire training.

I hear statements like "we don't have fires anymore" or "the number of fires are down" or "most of what we do is EMS". There are plenty of services and agencies available to provide EMS, install car seats, etc. but only one agency can provide fire protection and that is the fire service.

We need to stay on top of our game and not get too far from our mission and original purpose for existing. I do not blame the firefighters for not finding the trapped victim I blame the fire service for allowing itself to get too far away from it's original mission of protecting life and property from fire. Dinosaur? I don't think so. Why haven't fire deaths decreased? Why haven't firefighter fatalities decreased? Why do we continue to make the same mistakes over and over across the country? That's right. You guessed it. Good training and experienced fire officers. As the saying goes "train as if your life (and other's) depends on it because it does.

Stay focused on your job and train. People are counting on you to be able to perform when the bell sounds. God bless.
 

I have been in the firefighting business for 30 years in urban/ suburban settings not unlike Fairfax County. My overall impression is what a pathetic operation. It was actually physically painful to listen to. From the radio transmissions that were actually understandable, it sounds like all they cared about was using textbook NIMS terminology, rehab and PAR checks. I bet they had their little vests on and a nice neat looking command chart on their clipboards.
Can someone explain to me, how do you go to rehab with a victim still in the building?
This just reinforces what many of us have been saying for years, the fire service in this country has lost focus on it’s core mission -- to fight fire and to be highly trained to fight fire.
In many departments across the country, like Fairfax, firefighting has become a part-time job of people who are essentially full-time paramedics. Fairfax, like many other departments do not want good firefighters. It does not pay to be a good firefighter. The overriding concern for hiring and promotion is being a paramedic. This is the tragic end result. Not only for Debra Chiles and her family but for all the others who will suffer a similar fate.
 

IT IS NOT ANYONES DUTY TO PLACE BLAME EXCEPT FOR THE GUYS THAT WERE ON THAT JOB. THINGS WILL NOT ALWAYS GO AS PLANNED ON THE FIREGROUND. THAT IS WHY WE HAVE RIT TEAMS.
 

First off to Statter and the rest of the Monday morning qaurterbacks how many of you have truly been in a fire, anyone can type! thats what I thought! Second yes mistakes were made and with that follows corrections. If you could please show me a fire department without mistakes you have truly created something. Stater hopefully you read your comments, don't be bitter because you couldn't hack it as a firefighter. Way to be one sided, you are a discrace to the brotherhood.
 

There seems to be complacency in their voices from the get go. Even after 26 years of firefighting I still get a controlled excitement when I know someone is entrapped and we never give up searching until we find them, espcially when we know for a fact there was someone entrapped inside. Very disappointing. We all make mistakes, however, there is no excuse for complacency in this job.
 

Hey Debbie- It's called upper body strength!!! Please stop your BS, The next thing you'll want is a GPS system. I have worked with legends that have put (themselves)at extreme personal risk time and time again to pull people ( FF's and civillians) out of burning buildings. Its called risk vs reward, and while I won't Monday morning QB this event, the rewards ( saving a known life ) far outweigh keeping your own ass safe.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way...


Lt Serge Burak, Ret FDNY 1985-2005
 

First things first, I don't believe everyone on here is a firefighter. So I'm going to say that I am. I have over 20 years in the service as a volunteer and paid FF. I am not going to comment on what might, should, or could have happened, because I wasn't there. But I know this... if you are not a FF then you can have your opinion, but please keep it to yourself so you can stay warm at night. What happened in this case has nothing to do with hiring practices or lack of training or diversification of services. It has to do with making a mistake. I find it hard to believe that when they responded to the call and learned that a human life was trapped in the building they decided to leave her to die because somebody didn't want to go in. They respond so many units anyway there had to be at least two FF's that wanted to go and save her. I will say that after listening to the audio it does sound like a few of them didn't care. Again I wasn't there and I don't know these guys so I'm only speculating.
This is a tragedy and we need to know what happened without shooting ourselves in the foot. In the end we should learn from this and leave the "opinions" to the "wanna bees".
 

This incident does not shed a negative light on Fairfax alone it sheds a negative light on the fire service as a whole. The people we (firefighters) swore to protect have a valid reason to lose sleep over the perceived blatant disregard for Miss Chiles welfare. All firefighters are professionally trained for that moment, most pray that the moment never occurs, but if it does WE ALL KNOW what needs to be done. Risk alot to save alot correct? It wasn't done there and that is something that the people on that fireground have to live with forever. Anyone that is defending their actions needs to ask themselves would you be so understanding if that was a member of your family? My advice to Fairfax County would be to pay the settlement, train harder, and do whatever you can to ensure that it never happens again.
 

" A couple sounded like they did not care on the audio".

"They respond with so many units that there had to have been two FFs that wanted to save her."

"Anonymous" I do not know where you spent 20 years in the fire service but I spent 27 in a major urban department(Atlanta). I cannot imagine fellow firefighters I worked with in those 27 years "not caring" on a known rescue or any rescue, much less having to say that there had to have been at least two FFs that cared out of all the units responding.

Some "stuff" will happen on the emergency scene, but most are predictable and therefore preventable. On the other hand back to back fires, heavy call volume, fatigue, etc., etc. are all factors that can also effect judgment and performance as we are only human and have limitations.

Then you say training has nothing to do with the mistakes made on the fire ground. Granted "stuff" happens but training is an essential factor toward eliminating critical "stuff" happening or not happening on the fire ground.

I still contend that the fire service has spread themselves "thin" thereby negatively impacting its focus and training time in many major fire departments. I know from first hand experience so I am not just saying this as an outsider or as some "wanna be" as you might say. I speak from 27 years of service in a major metro fire department as a well-experienced firefighter, driver, line officer, battalion chief, chief of training and deputy chief.

I have no doubt that these firefighters re-live this incident over and over in their minds and would never have wanted the outcome to be what it turned out to be. I made mistakes on the fire ground and know what the "re-live" is like. I learned from every fire I responded to and attempted to become better with each one.

Public scrutiny can be brutal on top of such a tragic event. What I was attempting to say before was that I do not blame or judge them for what happened, but rather am concerned that the fire service and its leadership (including myself), have lost focus on its primary mission and is distracted by demands from outside. It is not about blame or excuses it is about examining what happened and why, learning from it and hopefully not repeating the same mistake.

Be safe and look out for one another. 4 sets of eyes are better than one in a fire company. The FF with you may see something you don't and vice versa.
 

Short of suicide missions, we as firefighters have an obligation to make every honest attempt at rescues. That includes taking a REAL beating trying to do everything in our power to do the job we accepted.

This should not be a pretty or easy job, we should not be in rehab after one cylinder of air putting out a kitchen fire with confirmed victim with known location.

Whoever made the comment that there is a basic culture change within fire department is correct, and it's not just Fairfax, it's creeping into many departments.

Everyone, every department is going to make mistakes. Missing victims does not only happen in Fairfax. They now need to ensure it doesn't occur again and again and again.

Somehow we need to balance modern health & safety guidelines with the old timer "can do" attitudes when it comes to fighting fires and making rescues. We need both, having one without the other does not serve either ourselves or the public well.
 

Fairfax's primary concern is looking pretty on paper to maintain federal funding. The Lorton fire is only one example, the March '07 double fatal fire in Chantilly just didn't get any attention.
Time to start firing the yard breathers and hiring some firefighters!
 

Wow, the info E419 got from Comm was very clear. Caller on third floor bathroom, stuffing towel under the door.

Only the first arriving company will ever know what went wrong on this call.
 

I would just like to ask a question? With the fire on the first floor, and smoke accumulation on the second and third floors, wouldn't ventilation on the second and third floors be in order, like taking out the third floor windows, then the second floor windows, then setting up a ppv fan at a first floor doorway? What say you all? My prsumption here, until someone says differently, is that the ventilation I asked about wasn't done. Yes, I am a fire fighter, and I'm merely trying to better my own knowledge of fire fighting.
 

Not only was there Chantilly there was also the disgraceful fireground performance at Kingstowne when 2 or 3 women were killed. They only way they are going to change is after they get tired of the painful glare of the spotlight.
 

O.K.,

Apparently, listening to the audio, the engine officer from engine 441 took out some third floor windows with the aerial ladder and was waiting for word from the interior as to whether or not he and his crew was needed to make the third floor from the ladder......apparently someone was there with the right frame of mind towards saving that women.
 

This is yet another example a sad event. I am a firefighter of about 6 years and now currently fighting the war on terroism. I serve this country with pride and dignity and it breaks my heart to hear people talking down to the people who are back home keeping families, pets, houses and all other things we as Americans take for granted. Ill be the first to say that when those tones drop, you race to the truck and show on scene that all that bs about not caring goes out the window. Your first priority as a public servant is to the people who need you. I dont care what anybody says, until your faced with the choice of putting your life on the line for people you dont know, dont judge others who do it everyday so that you can sleep at night.
 

Fire fighters today are in the job for the money and glory. No glory here. Still get the money though.Forty years on the job, Ive never seen anything like the additude of the younger generation.
 

A representative from Fairfax FD went to Kingstowne shortly after the fire and spoke with residents to try to convince them the FD did all they could. Pretty bad when the residents recognize a subpar performance!
 

Fairfax's issues have several contributing factors. They are not common to just Fairfax, they are nation wide and can be found in every department from coast to coast in one form or another.

We (the fire service) hire people to fulfill demographic requirements set upon us by outside departments/agencies/political pressures. Gone are the days of hiring someone based on their level of physical strength, raw courage, and in born desire to help others. Now we hire people that are of a certain ethnicity or gender and do not bother to ascertain if they really want to be a firefighter or even if they know what it entails. Shame on the Fire Chief of any department that bows to such foolish and ultimately life threatening pressures!

Another issue at hand is the "all hazards" attitude that many departments across the country are being forced to adopt just to survive in our current economic environment. EMS, Technical Rescue, HazMat all of which requires money, training, the time to train, the time to stay proficient through continued training, oh and lest we forget still run the day to day calls.....there is only so many hours in the day and something has to give. Unfortunately it sound to me like Fairfax has elected to forego some basic suppression training. They are one of the leading departments when it comes to HazMat as well as Technical Rescue. They also are very good at taking care of their personnel when it comes to annual physicals, time for physical fitness training, putting an ALS provider on scene in less than 4 minutes 90
% of the time.....etc. But alas, the day still only has 24 hours in it......

Another issue at hand is like so many other departments Fairfax is getting younger, the really experienced people are retiring and the next generation has not been properly mentored or trained. This is not unique to Fairfax, it is happening everywhere: FDNY has more than 50% new officers, how many of them would still be gaining valuable experience as firefighters were it not for 9/11?

I would not want to be the guys that responded to this fire, they made some major mistakes. But the burden of responsibility is not theirs alone, they should take a proper share of it but so should the Fire Chief as well as his predecessors that allowed such an environment to exist in the first place.

Fairfax's staffing is sub par as well, they ride three people on a ladder truck, minimum should be four. They do not have functional staffing, you could have a brand new driver (min. of 2 years on the job), a brand new rookie, a brand new fire medic, and a very green officer riding on the engine. This happens across the country on a daily basis, how efficient is this team? Would you want this crew to fight a fire in your house while your loved ones were trapped inside? Again this is not the crew's fault, it is the political environment that allowed these circumstances to come together.

In the end, think about who you want to blame and make sure they are truly responsible.......
 

Your are correct when you say its not all the blame should go to the firefighers & officers on the scene. It also rests with the senior staff, fire chief, county human resources, and the board of supervisors. They have built the system the way it is now and have foster the culture and atmosphere which incapable, unmotiviated firefighter either keep their jobs or worse yet, are promoted.

You are also correct when you say its not just in Fairfax, but many departments are going down the same road.

When it comes to 4 on the trucks, clearly a crew of 4 is more effective. However, it doesn't matter whether you have 3 people on it not doing the job or you have 4 people on it not doing the job. The job still isn't getting done.
 

I still can't believe they got away with the Kingstowne fire and the unnecessary deaths there.

I guess, its happened again but this time Channel 9 news isn't going to let them swept the Lorton fire under the rug.
 

Dave,
Thanks for posting the audio tapes, but do you think you could post a longer version of the fireground channel if not all channels so that we can hear the finding of the victim and the subsequent rescue/removal of her. All 3 tapes seem to end before that happened and I think hearing more would be a beneficial teaching aid to firefighters to hear how the situation was handled. These tapes should serve as very important teaching aids for the fire service. Thank you for you work in following the fire service, etc even if some people don't like what you report at times.
 

A major issue with Fairfax is that they have not had a real fire chief since Warren Isman. Those that have occupied the position since him have been pawn manipulated by the board of supervisors.
 

Fairfax Fire & Rescue Department's motto is the following - "Diversity over Safety"

It should not matter what ethnicity or color you are except that you can the job and have an opportunity of being a competent FF.
 

Reply to John McNeil...
I was responding to a few of the individuals on here who seemed to find blame in everything they could think of. Including your comments on diversification of services. If we don't provide those services, then who is? In your positions with AFD you should know that the fire service is an ever-changing thing. We never stop learning. We just have to adapt to the world today and thats the way it is. As far as this particular incident (which is what this forum is all about) I don't feel that what happened can be blamed on "diversification of services".
I know that training is very crucial on the fireground. Its the foundation that has to be laid down before we send rookies out to the wolves. It also has to be continued throughout our careers to boost teamwork, and confidence and to battle complacency. The other issue you had with my comments was about who cares. I was trying to say the exact same thing you said in a different way. Maybe I was trying to sound a little too sarcastic instead of saying what I meant. I know that every man on that scene cared about that lady. I also know without actually being acquainted with those guys that they probably feel more guilt than any of us can fathom.
I appreciated your comments Chief McNeil you probably made alot more sense than anyone on here, myself included. I was attempting to make those "Monday morning Quarterbacks" (as they are called) think about what they were saying. You and I know that it never does any good trying to find blame when this sort of thing happens. Its better to learn from it and go on and make sure this doesn't happen again.
Kevin Adams
 

this is in reply to pops comment, i dont get paid a single dime for what i do as a fire fighter and i still do it. when ever the tones drop i head to the station to go help someone like you that i dont even know and very rarely do we even get a thanks, so no glory there either. i do it because i love to help people and nine out of ten fire fighters that you ask will say the same. its not about money or glory, its about pride you get out of doing something that you love.
 

Apparently very few people on the scene cared about the woman or they would have found her. They would have been talking on the radio about the trapped person in the bathroom and that she needs to be found! No excuses, find her!

It not that they took a beating and were driven out. They glanced around thought "Huh, all clear" and forgot about the woman. That is not caring, don't fool yourselves into thinking that.

I bet the only reason most of the people there feel bad is that they are scared they are going to get into trouble of some kind.

This is not the first time this has happened there, and nothing changed. Caring people and organizations, reflect upon their mistakes, learn from them, and make changes to ensure they don't happen again. Caring people, don't sweep it under the rug, make excuses, and allow it to keep happening.
 

As I read down the line at all of these comments which everyone is entitled to, it just seems to me as if we went from brothers and sisters who share a same passion to people who are trying to strike down a fire department who had made a mistake just like every single fire department in the world, again every single fire department in the world. Everyone talks about how the fire department has changed it seems to me like all these " anonymous" firefighters are helping the negative change. If I may, get off your horses learn from someones misfortune and learn a thing or two about brotherhood.
 

All of our brother firefighters and sisters don't share the same passion for our vocation. There are far too many who believe that the fire service is just a job.

Your are correct, we should all learn from each others mistakes. I believe that many people will take this event to heart and will have frank discussions on their own fireground operations and beliefs.

However, I don't think Fairfax as an organization will. They are no better or worse than most departments, although they won't admit that.

As someone else pointed out, its not all the fault of the rank and file. The responsibility is shared by the officers, senior leadership, fire chief, and BOS. You can't run a fire department like the water department, clerical staff, social services, etc.
 

"As I read down the line at all of these comments which everyone is entitled to, it just seems to me as if we went from brothers and sisters who share a same passion to people who are trying to strike down a fire department who had made a mistake just like every single fire department in the world, again every single fire department in the world. Everyone talks about how the fire department has changed it seems to me like all these " anonymous" firefighters are helping the negative change. If I may, get off your horses learn from someones misfortune and learn a thing or two about brotherhood."

The poster of this comment needs to read the comment above their's! There is a lot of truth in that post.
Fairfax continues to repeat the same mistakes, and has to keep getting the broom out. Those that work there do not like the status quo, but it is being force fed to us.
Unfortunately there is no change in sight. Maybe since this time the incident is in the public eye a positive change will come about.
 

A relatively small fire, according to many sources. If you've seen the pictures, you've noticed the boarded up windows, but other than a little bit of smoke staining above the window header, was there a significant heat or smoke pattern to indicate an intense fire? This was a vinyl siding townhouse, the vinyl hadn't even melted! Typical of Fairfax Fire & Rescue doing 2 things... Immediately calling a second alarm on all working fires, and Handing out fancy vests and pretty command titles. The dispatchers had her on the phone, she couldn't have stated any more clearly where she was. Her boyfriend was even found and stated she was inside. Stevie Wonder could've found her, so why couldnt one the highest paid, state of the art and modern professional fire services have done the same? Also, play back the audio and listen to how many dozen times the radios fade out and the transmission is "broken up". A revamp of their communications system is LONG overdue. I work in Northern Virginia with a neighboring department, frequently running mutual aid into Fairfax County, so I am quite familiar with how they operate and have several friends who work for that department. However to protect my interests in this day and age I must remain anonymous. What a shame and an embarrassment. Someone needs to be held accountable. I used to reside in Fairfax County, now I'm glad I moved to Maryland!
 

The current policy at the Fairfax County Fire and Rescue Academy is that no one fails. The recruits will be continuously recycled until they pass.
Common sense would dictate that the point of the academy is to weed out those that can not meet the standards for the job. New flash Fairfax, no everyone is cut out to be a firefighter! People can be taught many things; unfortunately Fairfax does not realize that COURAGE is not one of them.
Take a close look at how many recent academy graduates are on and will continue to be on light duty. That should make for nice careers at taxpayers’ expense. The Fire and Rescue Dept. is not fooling the field personnel by having these folks occasionally come off light duty for a day or two just to break the cycle for record keeping.
 

Ok, lets start off with the comment about diversity I am sure there were black and white persons looking for the victim so to make any comment that race made a factor in locating the victim is ignorant, and that shows why minorities need organizations so stop being ignorant. Now the fire chief had no right making a comment when the investigation was still on going.From what I hear it was a 30 minute interview where the media edited what they wanted, but I will get to you in a minute Dave Statteder. The time line from what I hear is inaccurate, because Fairfax uses MCTs so when the offier hit the button he was still down the street. The fire apparatus was still pulling up to the scene, then they needed to get there equipment and mask up. If anyone is familiar with rescues and engine companies they don't have ladders to reach the third floor.
Someone commmented on ppv, lesson for you fire must be controlled before ppv because the fire will blow up the stair to the victim. I was informed that the fire was blocking the steps. So you have to knock down the fire first. And for all of you rocket scientist out there lets not forget this is lightweight construction enter on the second floor before you get a knock on the fire, you may not be seeing your family tommorrow. I was also told that all the windows were closed with black smoke coming from them and the thermal imagers weren't working due to the amount of heat.. hint hint flashover conditions. So I will like to see any of you enter a structure and locate a victim on the third floor and get them out in under 2 minutes, because thats what we are really looking at, the point of death. Lets not forget the conditions you need to expose the victim to, more heat and smoke. I am sure her lungs would of been burnt from the heat. And for you Dave Statter why don't you release the entire 30 minute interview with the Fire Chief and not one your editing department got there hands on.. Last but not least we wouldn't be taking about this if those units had gotten there two minutes later and she had already passed which happens every day in this county. Oh yea why did the fire and smoke get such a head start were there smoke detectors?? Things that make you say hummm....
 

Smoke killed her not the fire and from looking at the situation the the windows were closed containing the smoke and the heat..aka the oven..
 

In answer to Virginia Firefighter:

The interview with Interim Chief David Rohr was (and I am guessing) about 7 minutes on tape. I don't know who gave you the half-hour figure.

I had a nice chat with the chief and Captain Chris Schaff for a few minutes before and a few minutes afterward.

If I can find the raw tape (my desk is a mess) I will try and post it, so you can be clear about what he said.

My impression was Chief Rohr, while not having an explanation as to why Debra Chiles was not discovered until it was too late, was not making any excuses.

Even when I brought up the fact that I had learned from some people that Ms. Chiles had a lot of things stacked in the living areas of her home, Chief Rohr made the comment, and I am paraphrasing, that despite that, we should have found her.

Chief Rohr agreed with former Alexandria Fire Marshal Mike Connor, who looked at the scene with us, that this wasn't a big fire. That the fire had reached the bottom of the stairwell, adjacent to the kitchen and was starting to go up the stairwell when it was knocked.

While Chief Rohr and I talked about some other recent fires involving lightweight construction where the fire was much more advanced (the Franconia fire with the mayday, was one of them), there was no indication that was the case here.

Chief Rohr and I did also discuss the layout of that townhouse where the only way out is the front door or windows in the front. He also talked about the need for sprinklers in a place like this.

Hope this helps.

Statter
 

Virginia Firefighter,
Ever heard of VES? How about throw a 24 ft. ladder to the second floor and use the interior stairs to the third floor.
Speaking of ventilation………. that takes care of the flashover issue.
And with an aggressive interior attack on the fire..... (remember we have a known victim).
Lightweight construction with intact drywall (since it was not an unfinished basement on fire) is a calculated risk to save a known rescue. Remember risk assessment; risk a lot to save a lot.
If you do not think you will ever have to risk your life as a firefighter (or are unwilling to), maybe you should seek alternative employment. Firefighting is dangerous, and then there is that firefighter’s oath to protect life and property.
Thermal imager! How did firefighters ever make rescues without them?
Two minutes, she was only unconscious at that point not dead! There is still a window of opportunity to possibly save her. Besides, it looks a little better to pull a victim out on a primary search and not be able to resuscitate them than find them during overhaul!
 

Hello all,
I was told about this site from a firefighter I met in the store. I live on Duck Hawk wy,which our townhouses back the one that burned.
We thank the firefighters for all of their efforts the outcome could of been much worse if they didn't stop the fire as I see in the news everyday, rows of townhomes burned down.
People were still sleeping in other homes which were attached.
My home was assessed last year at just over 300,000. So the fire and smoke did destroy much of the interior of the home. After serving a tour in Iraq you learn that the safety of you and your troops come first. Our community has moved on and we wish you all do the same. The firefighters didn't cause the fire,and I witnessed their efforts.
Dave Statter is also just doing his job with the info he is given. But I think its time to end this and move on Dave.
Thank you all for what you do.
 

Community Resident,
Pretty easy comment to make since you were not the one trapped in the fire.
Since you are not a firefighter, how would you know if the actions on the fireground were appropriate?
Fairfax County taxpayers are paying for Mercedes Benz quality service. Therefore, Dave Statter needs to continue his good work to make sure the citizens are not being given a Yugo.
 

Isnt the world full of Monday morning quarterbacks. I know some of these guys and have worked with them in the past. I can assure you there were plenty of decent guys there willing to bust their butts to find this woman. The job is not 9-5 and not controled by any means, but that being said it seemed like a room and contents that went sour. Mistakes are made and everyone should learn from them once the real FACTS are revealed.If you want to blame something blame the loss of years of experience that has been lost in that department. The old guys have moved on and the new breed doesnt seem to look at life in the same way as us old farts.
As to the Chief and his comments, maybe his timing was bad maybe what he said was twisted by the media. Say what you want Rohr is a stand up guy and always has been, A spade is a spade.
 

Wow! Virginia Firefighter: Your attitude is part of the problem with the fire service today. Shame on you and every firefighter that thinks like you.

This was a kitchen fire, there was no heavy fire extension to the rest of the townhouse. This was shown in the television photo's in the intial story. There is a shot of the ex-fire marshal in the livingroom that doesn't even have heavy smoke stains on the walls. The exterior has no or very little smoke stains on the intact vinyl siding.

I can't even begin to respond to your thoughts on firefighting.

Another Virginia Firefighter..
 

Word on the street is the new B-shift Deput Chief is sending firefighters home for having mustaches that are too long. Hmmmm............wonder if any firefighters are ever sent home for not doing their job on the fireground???? Someone needs to get their priorities straight!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Good thing the deer that fire station 12 saved didn't live in Lorton.